<br /> Comment: The future of APT? – Debian Planet

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    Comment: The future of APT?
    Submitted by robster on Saturday, February 24, 2001 – 12:24
    Folllowing the the release by Ximian of Red Carpet beta (Announcement), a package management application that allows you to install/update software packages using a nice GNOME interface. This product closely follows what apt (now at version 0.5 in sid), has been doing for a while now in Debian, a feature other distributions have been lacking until recently. Therefore the big question is, does Red Carpet mean the end of apt?

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    Subject: Re: Comment: The future of APT?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Wednesday, 2001/02/28 – 13:58
    Ummm… I might be mistaken here, but I thought that Red Carpet merely acted as a front-end to apt & dpkg (and rpm, etc). If that’s the case, how would RC be the “end of apt”?
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    Subject: Re: Comment: The future of APT?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Monday, 2001/02/26 – 08:43
    using a GUI for such an administrative task seems to me a regression. We would like the possibility to automatically update in a script, or crontab. And making gnome compulsory for administrative tasks is a big waste of ressources.
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    Subject: Re: Comment: The future of APT?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Sunday, 2001/02/25 – 16:35
    it doesn’t get much easier than opening a browser to debian.org, looking for the package you want, and then typing apt-get install , it’s especialy handy when you only exist in the console…
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    Subject: Re: Comment: The future of APT?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Sunday, 2001/02/25 – 11:23
    The Death of apt ?
    And how will I comfortably add software/update my DSL router and my Quake III server ? Should I buy 2 screens, or install the xlibs and gnome libs to do remote X display ?
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    Subject: Re: Comment: The future of APT?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Sunday, 2001/02/25 – 09:41
    “All your apt are belong to us” – Red Carpet Team, Ximian.
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    Subject: Re: Comment: The future of APT?
    Author: ressu
    Date: Sunday, 2001/02/25 – 10:04
    you have no chance to install make your time.
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    Subject: Re: Comment: The future of APT?
    Author: Crag
    Date: Monday, 2001/02/26 – 09:56
    some one set up us the package
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    Subject: Please stop the madness
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Monday, 2001/02/26 – 19:35
    You butchers!!! The english language deserves better than that!!!!
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    Subject: We can always debianize Red Carpet!
    Author: high
    Date: Saturday, 2001/02/24 – 23:30
    The thing that is so good with free software is that it always gives us users the final say. The scenery “Red Carpet kills apt” will only happen if users think there is no advantage using apt, and that I highly doubt. What will happen is that we now have two different system that will competite and also share knowledge and functions. Whish gives us a better product.

    And who say we can’t debianize Red Carpet to fully use all the power of apt? It could be what gnome-apt never got. Perhaps Progeny is working on something similar? I personly would like to see the debian community develop a apt front-end for gnome that appels to us all, or as many of us as possible =)

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    Subject: Re: Comment: The future of APT?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Saturday, 2001/02/24 – 22:25
    I for myself am using it right now in Debian Sid. I’ve been waiting for a good apt front-end for a long time, and the few I saw I didn’t like. I love the way Red Carpet works, its subscription system rocks because it is more Ximian friendly than apt, back then I had to fight against apt wanting to install newer packages from Debian all the time. Red Carpet has all apt features and the best front end!

    Good work Ximian primates!!!

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    Subject: Re: Comment: The future of APT?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Sunday, 2001/02/25 – 11:19
    Actually, it happens a lot that when Red Carpet complains about dependencies I can do a dist-upgrade without problems.
    Another problem is that you can’t add channels… how’s that, if you develop a piece of software you have to get it in all the distributions or you won’t be able to have your users magicly update it.
    Further, Red Carpet doesn’t provide a means to install individual packages. Does Ximian wants to lock us in or something? I think not, but it looks like it ;-).

    Despite my post so far I’m very pro-Ximian but I think they’re screwing up with their current version of Red Carpet. Perhaps they (or some other hacker) will make it also use apt-get.

    And if it’s their commercial intrests they’re worried about… I have no problem with them filling in the “unsubscribed channels”.

    Cheers

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    Subject: Wait a few days…
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Sunday, 2001/02/25 – 21:34
    I’m sure all the things that actually are missing will be incorporated at some time. This is the first release.
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    Subject: Re: Comment: The future of APT?
    Author: Integral
    Date: Saturday, 2001/02/24 – 16:44
    I doubt that Red Carpet will approach the power of apt in the near future. And by the time it does, apt will have moved on.

    Of course, that doesn’t answer the question. Given that 99% of the populace is more impressed by shiny widgets than by substance, I suspect that this will, in fact, kill apt among computer users as a whole.

    Daniel

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    Subject: Re: Comment: The future of APT?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Saturday, 2001/02/24 – 14:08
    Hmm I don’t think so, Red Carpet is nice if you’re just looking for stuff randomly.. but if you know what you want “apt-get install ” is a lot simpler than opening up a GUI app and clicking your way to it.
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    Subject: Re: Comment: The future of APT?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Saturday, 2001/02/24 – 14:10
    Though, it would be nice if Red Carpet was the installer accross all distributions eventually.. and apt for console?
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    Subject: Re: Comment: The future of APT?
    Author: yeti
    Date: Saturday, 2001/02/24 – 13:01
    A package maintaining tool has to be scriptable and useable on a plain console.

    All other frontends are nice but not essential!

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    Subject: Re: Comment: The future of APT?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Saturday, 2001/02/24 – 16:01
    I completely agree with you. Every graphical aid is that: an aid. If you have machine to waste maybe you don’t mind, or if you are trying to catch windows users …

    You don’t need overworked things when you can do things easily and simply. But some like complications.

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    Subject: Re: Comment: The future of APT?
    Author: yeti
    Date: Saturday, 2001/02/24 – 17:12
    I think it is just a matter of clean design to get the best of the two worlds.

    Just imagige an engine doing all the nice things communicating with the various frontends in a clean and well designed and defined way.

    One frontend could give all results to stdout in a “variable=value” notation to easily use (eval or source) them from the shell…

    Obviously the way to HTML like forms with their “name=somename value=somevalue” notation is not a big deal…

    …a curses frontend? No big deal then…

    …a graphical frontend? Design some dialogs, maybe convert the engine’s output to some XML input for some existing tools for that?

    Im not an expert in such things because I do not design UIs — I’m a networker…

    …but I’m sure: The problem is not the frontend, it is a well designed engine and a “protocol” between engine and the frontend…

    Am I dreaming?

    I fear I am…

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    Subject: Re: Comment: The future of APT?
    Author: Integral
    Date: Saturday, 2001/02/24 – 17:43
    > ..but I’m sure: The problem is not the frontend, it is a well designed engine and a “protocol” between engine and the frontend…

    This is what apt has provided for years (except that it’s a shared library and not a protocol)

    Daniel

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    Subject: Re: Comment: The future of APT?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Saturday, 2001/02/24 – 12:49
    “does Red Carpet mean the end of apt?”
    Over my dead body.
    — hmh@d.o, who likes console tools
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    Subject: How do you add a new channel to Red Carpet (Woody/Testing)
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Saturday, 2001/02/24 – 14:58
    Red Carpet has a Sid/Unstable channel (which just uses http.us.debian.org to get de debs). But no Woody/Testing channel.

    Does anybody know how I would add such a channel?

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    Subject: Re: How do you add a new channel to Red Carpet (Woody/Testin
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Monday, 2001/02/26 – 15:30
    You need to change the text in your /etc/debian_release (I believe that’s the file) from “testing/unstable” to “testing/woody”.
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