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    Debian GNU/Win32?
    Submitted by robster on Tuesday, August 21, 2001 – 12:45
    On the Debian developer’s mailling list there has been a proposed port of Debian to the Windows platform utilizing the CygWin GNU tools. The thread has not yet made the archives, so for those of you who do not subscribe to the list the initial post can be found below.


    hi

    I would like to discuss the birth of the new Debian port with you all

    the proposed name is 'Debian GNU/win'

    it will be a porting, to the Microsoft win32 architecture + Cygnus cygwin,
    of many Debian packages (but not all)

    this summer I have prepared a cross-build environment, in which I
    have installed
    cygwin GTK gdk glib gdk-pixbuf, libraries and headers;
    I could then succesfully cross-compile my program 'gtkmorph'

    to start building .debs, I need to discuss a few things with you all

    1) I need to patch dpkg to add the new port, and before that
    I need consensus at least on the name 'Debian GNU/win' that I propose

    I have also some ideas
    2) I will use the 'virtual mount' capability of cygwin: then
    the user will freely choose where to install the debian stuff
    (I am currently installing it under d:debian)
    while the Debian programs will see a regular debian file tree

    3) once the .debs for the base system are ready,
    I will prepare an installation program:
    a) a (console based) tool will ask where the debian stuff should go
    (as 'c:debian') and will set the virtual mounts
    b) 'debootstrap' (as a standalone tool, using mingw) will
    install the base system

    it will be possible to put everything on a CD (or on the web)


    if some people are willing to collaborate, I would appreciate if
    we could be given a space inside .debian.org, to work together
    (I am a mantainer)


    what do you think?

    a.

    --
    A Mennucc
    "È un mondo difficile. Che vita intensa!" (Renato Carotone)

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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: frabcus
    Date: Tuesday, 2001/08/28 – 15:34
    – I have needed and thought in detail about a similar thing myself. It was more like a C++ version of CPAN. I use quite a few open source libraries for C++ development under Windows, and it is hard to maintain installation of them all. The hard bit about this is compilers – ideally all the libraries should have the _native_ win32 versions, instead (or as well as) ones depending on cygwin DLL. And have .lib files for use with Visual C++.

    – Wouldn’t it be better to call it GNU/win32 rather than GNU/win?

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    Subject: why Debian GNU/Win32
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Tuesday, 2001/08/28 – 13:29
    where i work we are not allowed to install anything other than a common office environment, and a new OS (other than windows) is unlikely to make it into the COE in any forseeable future. however that doesnt mean i dont put activestate perl and cygwin on there (bad me). However i might get away with that with only a slap on the wrist, but booting into a new OS would make me incapable of doing most of my work.

    I think linux’s primary failing is its inacessability for new users, those primarily windows users going on the desktop usage figures. (80% windows, 15% mac, 5% other?). unless something is packaged with installshield or something that functions in a similar fashion allowing simple install/uninstall and configuration, those 95% are unlikely to even try any possible alternatives. It is not a matter of wether or not it should be done but to what length we ease them into a new visual interface from what they are used to. This is the critical factor in my opinion. Besides id like to be able to install it easily at work 😉

    meri

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    Subject: Why?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Sunday, 2001/08/26 – 23:00
    The main question that pops up with me is: why?
    Don’t get me wrong, people might want to use the GIMP or gcc under windoze, but nothing stops those people from switching to gnu/linux. Windoze users wouldn’t be interrested in GNU software, gnu/linux users wouldn’t even think about going back. There is only a very small portion of windoze-users who use cygwin, but there is a huge portion of windoze users who may be tempted by a good gnu/linux disto.
    Instead of putting such a lot of effort into a gnu/win OS not many people are going to use, why not help polish gnu/linux up, make the installation easier for newbies and more powerfull for experts.

    Ohwell, just my 2c’s…

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    Subject: Everything should go under ‘contrib’
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Sunday, 2001/08/26 – 21:48
    That is, being free software dependiong of non-free software … ( the OS and its libs ).
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    Subject: Why not Debian/ReactOS to keep it 100% free
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Saturday, 2001/08/25 – 01:03
    The idea to make a Debian distro that support
    windoze applications’s a good one.
    But why base it on M$ windows if there’s a
    free alternative.
    It’s in development status at the moment, and
    looks very promising.
    It needs time to make a stable kernel, as well as
    a new Debian distro needs time to put everything together.
    The home page of ReactOS projet’s:
    http://www.reactos.com/

    There could be a real cooperation Between Debian & ReactOS team, useful for both project. While I don’t think that M$ would support any Debian/win32 efforts.

    The only problem could be, if a Debian/ReactOS project succesfull /that compatible with windoze apps & drivers/ that M$ stocks would convergent
    to $0 making nasdaq index low 🙂

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    Subject: Re: Why not Debian/ReactOS to keep it 100% free
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Monday, 2001/08/27 – 23:41
    fantastic, that should have been everyones first thought.

    I hope he listens to you,
    I just checked www.reactos.com to make sure ReactOS
    is under a nice license and yup its’ GPL.

    Debian/ReactOS would be BIG.

    -Ciaran O’Riordan

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    Subject: Re: Why not Debian/ReactOS to keep it 100% free
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Monday, 2001/08/27 – 23:41
    fantastic, that should have been everyones first thought.

    I hope he listens to you,
    I just checked www.reactos.com to make sure ReactOS
    is under a nice license and yup its’ GPL.

    Debian/ReactOS would be BIG.

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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Friday, 2001/08/24 – 08:08
    Why not just get the linuXcare CD and reboot the windoze machine???
    Just a thought.

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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Thursday, 2001/08/23 – 17:39
    Es como una gran locura, red hat for windows ,naa fuck windows .
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    Subject: what should “apt-get dist-upgrade” do?
    Author: boecko
    Date: Wednesday, 2001/08/22 – 22:11
    interesting would be:
    type
    apt-get update
    apt-get dist-upgrade
    and u have a fresh install of a
    debian gnu/linux system
    on your former Windoze-box 🙂
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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Wednesday, 2001/08/22 – 18:20
    Windows will NEVER be GNU !!!!!!!!!

    You can port Debian software on Windows, but your port will NERVER be a *real* Debian like Debian Linux or Debian Hurd.

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    Subject: heh, heh
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Wednesday, 2001/08/22 – 19:40
    WNG does have a nice ring to it. I hope no one wastes too much time doing this. Why fool with MS junk when better and free alternatives can use your help?
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    Subject: please give us an URL
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Wednesday, 2001/08/22 – 17:32
    what will the port site be?

    perhaps http://www.debian.org/ports/win?

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    Subject: Re: please give us an URL
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Friday, 2001/08/24 – 16:24
    more likely..

    www.debian.org/ports/we_0wn_wintendo 🙂

    Really, I wouldn’t use it, and I think its wasted effort to port to win.
    Futhermore one would get into a conflict between, Debians social contract / guidelines and Wintendo licenses..

    The Debian effort is foremost to create a truely free OS, but to have as many ports as possible.

    Go ahead if you want to, but I urge you to work on The Hurd instead 🙂

    – Lovechild

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    Subject: Re: please give us an URL
    Author: d00d
    Date: Saturday, 2001/08/25 – 20:58
    I’m a GNU(Hurd) user, and planning to compile packages there.

    But GNU/win32 looks like a very strong weapon to fight micros~1. Have you thought about it? The main reason for windows users not to install GNU/Linux is *incompatibility* of some hardware (winhardware crap) and some software (games and a few more).

    Of course i wouldn’t use it myself as a production system, but i’d contribute building debs so actual windoze users can switch easily to Debian GNU/*

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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Wednesday, 2001/08/22 – 15:31
    Windoz is $#&+^}{.. 🙂 But it is a reality! Debian/win32 would be a killer for windoz platform using the windows against itself. Also the Debian platform can take advantage of the large number of windoz installations to spread effectively. Surely there will be problems with windoz based on the bugs, undocumented windoz stuff….
    However the opportunities are great. Dont forget:
    Debian is powerful not because it runs mainly on linux.
    The design, robust structure, wonderful installation and configuration mechanism make it so strong. With this features it can easily become an important structure in windoz space. One other thing:
    It is about development… I’ve searched for a coherent production, development environment on windoz. Unfortunately I could not find a good one. If Debian/win32 would turn out to be reality my search will be OVER… 🙂
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    Subject: Security
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Wednesday, 2001/08/22 – 14:54
    What would be really cool is if we could wrap http://windowsupdate.com updates into apt-get-able debs. Then, when you apt-get the latest security fixes in Debian, you also update your Windows stuff. Of course, due to copyright, EULA, etc. restrictions you’d probably be stuck using a wrapper package that wgets the fixes, aliens it, and installs it… but still, better than the current “solution”.

    Hell, why not just repackage the whole Windows distribution!

    :^)

    -l

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    Subject: You rule
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Wednesday, 2001/08/22 – 14:08
    This is an excellent idea. If I could use apt-get and dselect for keeping cygwin current I’d be happy as a clam.

    Of course, I’d prefer to run the Linux-based Debian, but as that is not an option where I work now, a Debianized Cygwin would certainly rule. Also, getting people hooked on apt-get (which they often are after trying it for the first time) would have definitive advocacy advantages.
    I am not qualified to judge how hard the technical problems associated with this project would be, and I can unforturnately not put any time in it, but you have my full moral support (for whatever it is worth).
    Best of luck to you, and have fun!!

    Cheers //Johan

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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Bad-Knees
    Date: Wednesday, 2001/08/22 – 13:03
    I wonder why anyone would do such a thing. Are there any good arguments for using win32-junk – its useless. These resources should rather be spent on making/improving applications on GNU/Linux platform.

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    Subject: This would be excellent
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Wednesday, 2001/08/22 – 14:32
    > I wonder why anyone would do such a thing.

    Because he wants to and needs it? I know *I* would love to use it.

    > Are there any good arguments for using win32-junk – its useless.

    Tell that to IBM who doesn’t release their java development environment VAJ for anything but Windows. That locks me into Windows at work. If I could use Debian GNU/Linux instead nobody would be happier than me, but unforturnately that’s not an option. Cygwin is a nice escape to a more familiar environment, and having apt-get under Cygwin would be excellent! And I can assure you, IBM not releasing VAJ for anything but Windows is not limited to either VAJ, IBM, me or my place of work.

    > These resources should rather be spent on making/improving applications on GNU/Linux platform.

    Well, that’s not what he’s offering. He isn’t interested in providing resources for that. If you think “making/improving applications on GNU/Linux” is better, sure, you do that. But just because this project would be of no use to *you* doesn’t mean that it’s useless to *everyone*.

    For one thing, the advocacy value of this would be great. This would lower the threshold for trying out Debian enormously for any Windows users. And if it made Debian the default Unix-environment for Windows, what distro do you think Windows users would choose when they decide they want a Linux solution?

    Also, porting stuff to more platforms gets you more users, gets you more bug reports, gets you more developers, but you don’t seem to think that would be of any use to Debian?

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    Subject: Re: This would be excellent
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Wednesday, 2001/08/22 – 22:19
    Why do you think their would ever switch to a Linux solution?. They can have all the Linux tools and still be running Windows.
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    Subject: Re: This would be excellent
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Thursday, 2001/08/23 – 11:44
    Stability? Predictability? Licensing cost? Ease of maintainance? At least those are the reasons I prefer Linux over Windows (I don’t have to fix the same problem over and over again).

    If people discover they are mostly / exclusively (sp?) using tools that are available under Linux anyway, Windows is just a liability.

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    Subject: Re: This would be excellent
    Author: coba
    Date: Thursday, 2001/08/23 – 00:01
    Well maybe because by using Linux they can avoid paying license fees. And if they already know the tools used on LInux that’s one less barier to switching isn’t it?
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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Wednesday, 2001/08/22 – 08:30
    From talking to friends of mine who aren’t linux users, but occasionally use linux when over at a friends house, the most common complaint I hear from them, is that Linux can’t do as much as Windows can.

    That obviously is untrue, but to them it is true, because they are not experienced with tools that are availiable in linux, and since windows does not have the same tools, they couldn’t possibly be.

    Installing Linux is a daunting task for a first time user, they haven’t used any of the utilities before, the file system is different, etc.

    I think it’s great that these tools are going to be brought to Windows, windows users can get used to the tools, and how things operate, and then, when they are comfortable, install a full linux system.

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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Wednesday, 2001/08/22 – 22:16
    Why would they bother installing Linux then, when they can get all the linux tools under windows.
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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Thursday, 2001/08/23 – 03:05
    Because they don’t get the linux kernel, which is one of the reasons to want to try linux in the first place.
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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Wednesday, 2001/08/22 – 07:57
    I would never ever use it.
    I don’t like the idea mixing with M$ products.

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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Wednesday, 2001/08/22 – 14:38
    <rant>
    Well, if you wouldn’t use it, they can just as well give up can’t they? ’cause if you won’t, how will they ever get a single user of Debian GNU/Windows? BTW, why don’t you post a list of all apps you use so the maintainers of other apps can just quit go kill themselves. Likewise for hardware platforms, can I keep using my PentiumIII, or are you using anything else so that I have to switch?
    </rant>
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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Wednesday, 2001/08/22 – 04:05
    This is a great idea! We need these sort of Fresh Tendrils. Linux will not take over the corporate desktop in one giant step, but this would make an excellent start.
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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Wednesday, 2001/08/22 – 22:12
    How exactly would this help linux adoption?
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    Subject: It provides a transitioning path
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Thursday, 2001/08/23 – 00:12
    I think the Point of Sale system that I work on could be migrated to Debian with something like this. With Microsoft’s licensing changes, we are not anxious to stay on Windows, but there is not an obvious transition path away.

    I’ve never looked closely at cygwin, so I don’t know what possibilities exist. If the Windows components could be made to talk to processes in cygwin, then it might be possible to transition each piece one at a time until there is no longer a dependency on Windows.

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    Subject: Living Dead
    Author: leandro
    Date: Wednesday, 2001/08/22 – 03:42
    There has been for many years a debian-win32 list for that, but never going forward. It seems that everyone with the right skills have too much on his hands or quickly migrates to Debian GNU/Linux or even Hurd.

    Perhaps now with Windows 2000 staying inside Gates will be tolerable enough that someone comes thru with some real work done.

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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Wednesday, 2001/08/22 – 02:30
    What about copyright and other licence ? I think you should check these before start any work …

    I think that the licence for some programming tool prohibit the production of GPL software.

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    Subject: I think this would be great!
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Wednesday, 2001/08/22 – 01:59
    The easier we can make it for Windows users to get familiar with, and start using, free software tools, the better for everybody. Systems like Gimp, Apache, Ghostview, VNC, Galeon, Konqueror, etc. are of interested even to mainstream Windows users.
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    Subject: noooooooo!
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Wednesday, 2001/08/22 – 19:35
    The programs are great. Porting them to MS is a bad idea. The developers will constantly be chasing MS’s shifting interfaces, and the users will not know any better when GIMP breaks. They will simply think, “GIMP sucks. I’m glad I have my MS tools ready to help me.” Porting stuff to comercial OS will only make people comfortable in their slavery.
    Many of these programs already have Windoze ports anyway. Like Apache, see here. I can’t understand why people do this when free alternatives are available.
    Don’t spend your time working for MS, it’s better put into the Free world.
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    Subject: Yes!!
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Thursday, 2001/08/23 – 12:02
    So, you want to prevent Windows users from trying out the programs available for Debian. Good idea. I bet the GIMP developers would really appreciate not getting any Windows users either, that’s probably why they ported GIMP to Windows in the first place.

    Personally I could imagine a person getting used to apt-get under Windows, and then getting keen on having the same functionallity (sp?) for upgrading the whole system.

    As for chasing MS’ shifting interfaces, that’s what the Cygwin people are doing already. I don’t see how stopping this project would prevent that.

    Face it, this is a great transitioning path; install Debian/w32, try out some tools, get dependent on some of the tools, replace native windows tools with cross-platform Debian ones one at a time in a suitable pace, then move to Debian on a real kernel like Linux. Today, that path is: Think about installing Linux, get Redhat, fail to use it because everything is so very different from what you’re used to, give up and go back to Windows. Exactly how do you think the latter benefits Debian?

    And if some people prefer Windows + Debian tools over Debian GNU/Linux, why not cater to them too? Isn’t more users good?

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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: andrew_barnes7
    Date: Tuesday, 2001/08/21 – 21:55
    well, I for one use cygwin on my own Windows machine and my work machine. As I use debian on my actual linux machine I would appreciate any work you do on this. I would also be glad to help with documentation and testing..
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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Tuesday, 2001/08/21 – 21:34
    I think this is a wonderful idea! I just recently installed CygWin and it is ok, but I really miss all the nice management features of a full Debian install!

    Good luck,

    Raf.

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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: nelson
    Date: Tuesday, 2001/08/21 – 16:07
    Fascinating idea!

    Would you target any Win32? I would think working on the DOS kernel (Win95/98/ME) would be a real nightmare – Cygwin doesn’t work very well there. But on WinNT/2K/XP, it could work pretty well.

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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Friday, 2001/08/24 – 01:21
    Why is this guy considered a troll, but the guy that said “what a joke” is considered fascinating? Are these forums like /. where anyone that supports win32 is blacklisted? Seriously, people such as myself can enjoy debian GNU/Linux as well as Win32 systems. Furthermore, many people have to use Win32 systems at work (and saying use both isn’t an option; not everyone get’s two machines or has the option to dual-boot). And all this anti-MS attitude just tends to piss people off such as myself, who enjoys both. I never hear any MS users call me dumb for running Linux. So, I suppose this will classify me as a troll, but maybe it’ll promote a more unbiased POV around here.
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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: henley
    Date: Tuesday, 2001/08/21 – 13:46
    Having recently (..er… Friday) attempted to get CygWin’s own toolset to install properly[1] under W98 (I know, I know… but it’s a work system), I can *definitely* see the attractions of apt-get under Windows.
    However, what with the underlying OS being such a *critical* part of any delivered solution, and what with this *particular* underlying OS being so …er… unamenable to third-party control (change by all means but honestly: control?), I can see this admirable effort ending up buried in the aptly-named “DLL Hell” effect.
    Or, to put it another more positive way: if someone can demonstrate that “apt-get update gimp” can result in verification *and* remediation of all underlying dependent Windows DLL/DRV/VXDs *without* inducing problems for the n other windows apps installed on the box, then I’m sold….
    [1] – Does anyone know how to get “|” in a W98 bash shell with a UK keyboard? Or how to get “man” to avoid failing before catting the file? ‘cus I’m stuck…
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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Tuesday, 2001/08/21 – 23:34
    It’s a pain, I know, but ALT-1 2 4 (ie hold down ALT press and release 1, 2 and then 4 on the numeric pad, probably only with NUMLOCK off) works for me.
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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: henley
    Date: Wednesday, 2001/08/22 – 11:11
    Thanks very much
    Would you believe that *still* doesn’t work?
    Sigh.
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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Tuesday, 2001/08/21 – 17:23
    | on a british keyboard is on the key that is right of the “left shift”. without shift, | whith it.

    Gabriel

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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: henley
    Date: Tuesday, 2001/08/21 – 22:12
    Yeah, I can *see* it’s printed there. However both the Linux/X session on the *other* partition on the disk and the native w98 Dos box both require AltGR-` to get “¦” printed.
    Neither of which, needless to say, work under CygWin Bash.
    But thanks anyway….
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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Tuesday, 2001/08/21 – 15:39
    I think DLL hell can be avoided by simply using a separate hierarchy for all Debian stuff and adding [PATH] to it in all the appropriate places. As under any Debian, you expect the admin not to install programs under the official hierarchy that will be overwritten in the next apt-get install.

    Besides, I thought the problem was win32 programmer laziness and unwillingness to put files anywhere other than in the C:WINDOWS hierarchy??

    -l

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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Tuesday, 2001/08/21 – 13:18
    What a joke…..
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    Subject: actually…
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Saturday, 2001/08/25 – 15:37
    This is pure genius. Get windows people to use *nix apps, so when they are tired of windows’s problems they can switch to linux without having to retrain.

    It’s the app base that matters, not the kernel.

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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Tuesday, 2001/08/21 – 14:28
    I don’t see it as much of a joke. It’d be pretty useful, actually. UNIX has a lot of powerful utilities, aside from the OS itself, and it’d be nice to be able to run them on a Windows machine. Hell, I might even be tempted to start running Windows at work again, since I’d be able to keep using the programs I run now, with the ease of configuration and installation that Debian provides, but have Windows ready to run Office (all we use here at work), and to run IE (I’m a web developer, need to test pages in all the browsers, you know…)
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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: crazney
    Date: Tuesday, 2001/08/21 – 21:34
    1) abiword, staroffice, openoffice, etc.
    2) im a web developer aswell.. i first test in konq, moz, netscape, opera.. then go over to someone else machine and test in IE – or get someone on the net to.
    🙂
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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Tuesday, 2001/08/21 – 16:21
    Hell, I might even be tempted to start running Windows at work again

    Wouldn’t that be a reason to _not_ make Debian GNU/Win32 happen?

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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Tuesday, 2001/08/21 – 17:32
    That’s the exact same thing I was thinking most people would think when I made that post, but seriously – right now, my job is a pain in the arse. Wine doesn’t work well, and a virtualization software package is too big and bulky for my workstation’s low specs. Running my Debian/Linux tools natively in Windows with nothing more than a thin emulation layer and a support DLL will vastly increase the ease of my job, saving for the crashes I’d probably start having every couple days…

    The only alternatives to the above situation is that a) I keep using nothing but Debian, and have an annoying job, b) get Wine up to par, or c) dump Debian altogether and run IE/Mozilla/Netscape/Opera completely on Windows, with the Win32 port of VIM for my editor.

    I’d prefer choice B) above all other, but Wine just isn’t there yet, and I’m not nearly good enough of a programmer yet to help out with the things they need most right now.

    I’m sorry that the truth sucks.

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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Saturday, 2001/08/25 – 20:24
    Our solution is to have a win2k application server and use rdesktop to connect and run the few things that linux heads need. Our win2k/debian is fairly well integrated (homes are served from win2k NFS server and the SFU passwd synch daemon works… but the SFU NIS server sux and msft did a HORRID job translating unix permissions to windows) so with a good x11 client anyone can have the best of both worlds at any time wether they prefer windows or unix.
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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Saturday, 2001/08/25 – 00:39
    d) If U need windows environment, ie office, etc…
    so much, there are:
    -plex86 that’ll suit even for your workstation’s low specs http://www.plex86.org
    -win4lin http://www.netraverse.com/
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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: tim_olsen
    Date: Wednesday, 2001/08/22 – 02:44
    have you tried vmware? it’s not free, but it works really well.
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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: rreames
    Date: Tuesday, 2001/08/21 – 21:57
    Why only one computer? I have two computers on my desk. A Sparc running Debian and a WinNT machine. I maintain the web sites for three magazines and having Samba and Apache on the Sparc works great. I can develop on both machines run my work apps on the NT box and the rest of my work I do on the Debian/Sparc. I run my test server on the Sparc and upload to the main server from there. With hardware so cheap why try and cram everything into one box?
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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Wednesday, 2001/08/22 – 09:09
    There are people in this world that have to work on NT (with no choice). If we could at leaste have a GNU system under the hood to help up out it would be incredible.

    If you really think about it, getting people used to using GNU software on NT, once they are used to all the software they love, what is a kernel ? (IE why do i put up with the BSA).

    It could do alot for the mindshare of alot of people that dont see GNU as approachable.

    just my $0.02

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    Subject: Re: Debian GNU/Win32?
    Author: Anonymous
    Date: Wednesday, 2001/08/22 – 10:28
    Well, tell that to RMS
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